Complaints

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• Initial Complaint

  Date:09/18/2024

  Type:Billing Issues
  Status:

  ResolvedMore info

  Complaint statuses

  Resolved:

  The complainant verified the issue was resolved to their satisfaction.

  Unresolved:

  The business responded to the dispute but failed to make a good faith effort to resolve it.

  Answered:

  The business addressed the issues within the complaint, but the consumer either a) did not accept the response, OR b) did not notify BBB as to their satisfaction.

  Unanswered:

  The business failed to respond to the dispute.

  Unpursuable:

  BBB is unable to locate the business.

  Our soccer club hired the company "Forever Faith" to furnish our soccer uniforms this year. I took my children to the fitting event on 6/17/2024 where Forever Faith furnished uniforms to try on for fitting. Both my 10 y.o. female and 8 y.o male. The Forever Faith **** at the fitting gave my 10 yo a youth M and my 8 yo a youth large. Both uniforms fit and we placed our order.When the uniforms arrived, my 8 y.o. boy's fit fine but the 10 y.o. was skin tight on her. When comparing the uniforms together, you can clearly see that the youth medium is a womens cut uniform with an hourglass shape and the youth Large is a universal cut that is box shaped. At the fitting, the forever faith *** mentioned all youth uniforms are the same. That is clearly not the case as the girls uniforms are a womens cut making it too small once we recieved the ********** discussions with forever faith they claim this is not a quality issue on their part because we got a youth medium which is what we ordered. But we ordered a youth medium universal cut because thats what we were given to try on and told there were no difference in the youth jerseys. We received the just a few days before our first game so when I ***orted the issue to Forever Faith, they took no accountability in the differences between jerseys they had us try on at the fitting and the jersey's we received. Forever Faith charged me another $250 for a new set of uniforms on top of the original purchase. In a hast to get the uniforms as quickly as possible, I paid it.Only to have another Forever Faith **** try and upcharge me again when picking up the corrected jersey for another $150 for a factory mistake in making another jersey There is no differentiating a youth medium "womens" cut or a 'universal' cut on the ordering form as it just says youth Medium. So we thought we were getting the universal cut because thats what the **** gave us to try on and thats the box we checked when ordering.

  Business Response

  Date: 09/18/2024

  1. The client did not hire Forever Faith to provide soccer uniforms. The *********** of Directors did this with a written agreement that defines the relationship, products, services provided. According the soccer club's membership agreement, the parents were required to directly pay Forever Faith for the uniforms.

  2. The uniforms are custom designed and produced to order. No refunds are available. The customer is responsible for the fees to cover replacement items if the provided a sizing error. Forever Faith does offer a no charge replacement solution if an error is made from Forever Faith. 

  3. The customer marked down the size for ********************** to be produce based on the sizing kit provided. Forever Faith began production. Prior to receiving their order, Mrs. ********* called to ask for a new size to be custom produced because she realized that the size that they marked on the order sheet was incorrect. Forever Faith told her the re-order policy. The original uniform kit was $350.00, and we offered to discount the kit for $100 to help. So they paid $250.00 instead of $350.00.

  4. The issue with a women's cut being different than what was tried on at the in-person sizing event does not apply to his complaint. They marked the incorrect size and then requested a new size be custom produced. They understood they made the mistake and thus why they paid for the replacement items.

  4. The new uniform was produced and delivered. Forever Faith's factory made a mistake during the re-order and produced (2) kits instead of (1) replacement kit. Forever Faith simply offered the second kit as an additional kit to the customer for a further reduced price of $150.00. This was only an option if desired...not a requirement, which was made clear to Mrs. ********** If that option was not desired Forever Faith would simply keep it to make available to another player as needed. 

  5. After ***** ********* deceived Forever Faith into reproducing the kit, that he received, he proceeded to dispute the charges with his credit card company and kept the $350.00 uniform kit. This is actually illegal theft. 

  This incident was also reported to the Board of Directors of the Soccer Club. 

  Customer Answer

  Date: 09/20/2024

  I am rejecting this response because:   
  1. we were provided a universal cut at time of fitting

  2. they youth M unfortunately verbal cut was the size that fit 

  3. we recieved a youth M womens cut

  4. the difference between the universal M and the womens youth M is why we had to order a new kit

  5.  Why would we reorder the same size jersey after knowing the womens cut does not fit like the universal

  6. how is it not forever faiths error in providing a universal cut jersey at the time of fitting but then delivering a womens cut?

  7. Forever faith did not explain there were different cuts of uniforms

  8. after discussing with **** board they said all youth jereseys were supposed to be all universal fits

  9. After discovering that there were two different cuts of jerseys we reordered a adult S because this time we knew we would receive a womens cut jersey and a youth L would have been what we normally order from a reputable company that stands behind their products but in this case we didnt want to have to deal with forever faith anytime soon so we went with an even bigger size to eliminate dealing with forever faith anytime soon in the future

  10. had forever faith provided womens cuts at the time of fitting we would not have had to reorder anything

  11.  Forever faith is misleading in their products and the sizes of their uniforms they provide

  12. forever faith had no contact with my wife until she picked the kits up

  13. nowhere on the order form does it differentiate a universal cut jersey with a womens cut jersey

  14. Providing a universal cut jersey for fitting and then delivering a womens cut is an error on forever faith. Thats what led to having to reorder the jerseys

   

  Business Response

  Date: 09/25/2024

  1. we were provided a universal cut at time of fitting - 

  FF response: (Yes, this is correct)
  
  2. they youth M unfortunately verbal cut was the size that fit 
  
  FF response: (not sure what this means?)
  
  3. we recieved a youth M womens cut (the client wrote down a Youth Medium on the order sheet. 
  
  FF response: Prior to them receiving any items, Mrs ********* contacted us because she found the order sheet in her car and realized they had made an error on the order sheet (no one the team had received items at that point). It was then she asked me personally to reproduce the order in an Adult Small Womens cut. This was not based on them receiving the incorrect size, this was Mrs. ********* seeing the error on the order sheet and calling in to order a larger size. That is when I explained our order policy and that it was the customers responsibility to provide the proper size on the order sheet (for this exact reason) and would need to pay for the remake. Thats also when I offered a $100 discount, she wasn't happy but appreciated it, and paid for the new uniform kit. 
  
  4. the difference between the universal M and the womens youth M is why we had to order a new kit 
  
  FF response: (not true, see my reply to #3)
  
  5.  Why would we reorder the same size jersey after knowing the womens cut does not fit like the universal 
  
  FF response: (they did not order the same size, they ordered an Adult Small Womens cut) 
  
  6. how is it not forever faiths error in providing a universal cut jersey at the time of fitting but then delivering a womens cut? 
  
  FF response: (This would be an error on our end and we would cover the expense to correct the error. This did happen in some cases and we have remade jerseys at our expense for those errors. But this is not the issue that Mr. ********* had and thats why we charged them for the remake. Again, see #3)
  
  7. Forever faith did not explain there were different cuts of uniforms 
  
  FF response: (yes we did, and we made them in mens, womens, and youth sizes in different colors to differentiate sizes and cuts.)
  
  8. after discussing with **** board they said all youth jereseys were supposed to be all universal fits 
  
  FF response: (this is correctbut that is not why we charged the Blackwoods for the remake)
  
  9. After discovering that there were two different cuts of jerseys we reordered a adult S because this time we knew we would receive a womens cut jersey and a youth L would have been what we normally order from a reputable company that stands behind their products but in this case we didnt want to have to deal with forever faith anytime soon so we went with an even bigger size to eliminate dealing with forever faith anytime soon in the future. 
  
  FF response: (This is not accurateand if you look at point # **, Mr. ********* states that we never had contact with his wife until she picked up the remade uniforms that were picked up. How would we have known to order a new uniform kit in Adult Small (with payment) had we not spoken with her. We have never spoken to ***** ********* on the phone, we have only had some text messaging correspondence. We did however speak to his wife on the phone.
  
  10. had forever faith provided womens cuts at the time of fitting we would not have had to reorder anything 
  
  FF response: (this is not accurate based on his complaint)
  
  11.  Forever faith is misleading in their products and the sizes of their uniforms they provide 
  
  FF response: (we produced uniforms for almost 600 players and this statement is false)
  
  **. forever faith had no contact with my wife until she picked the kits up 
  
  FF response: (see point # 9)
  
  13. nowhere on the order form does it differentiate a universal cut jersey with a womens cut jersey 
  
  FF response: (it did not need to. The player tries the uniform on and selects the one that fitssimple)
  
  14. Providing a universal cut jersey for fitting and then delivering a womens cut is an error on forever faith. Thats what led to having to reorder the jerseys. 
  
  FF response: (This has been addressed multiple times now and again, this is not the issue that they had)
  
  Note: Not only has Mr. ********* admitted to fraudulently paying for the remakes (to the BBB in his original complaint), and then refuted the charges, but hes also asking that the entire order be refunded getting all items for free.   

  Customer Answer

  Date: 10/04/2024

  I have reviewed the business response and accept this resolution.