Complaints

This profile includes complaints for LBR LLC's headquarters and its corporate-owned locations. To view all corporate locations, see Find Local Branches.

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  LBR LLC

  6550 Tower Ln Claremore, OK 74019-4373

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  LBR LLC

  7279 E Poser Rd Claremore, OK 74019-2208

The complaint text that is displayed might not represent all complaints filed with BBB. Some consumers may elect to not publish the details of their complaints, some complaints may not meet BBB's standards for publication, or BBB may display a portion of complaints when a high volume is received for a particular business.

• Initial Complaint

  Date:06/24/2024

  Type:Service or Repair Issues
  Status:

  AnsweredMore info

  Complaint statuses

  Resolved:

  The complainant verified the issue was resolved to their satisfaction.

  Unresolved:

  The business responded to the dispute but failed to make a good faith effort to resolve it.

  Answered:

  The business addressed the issues within the complaint, but the consumer either a) did not accept the response, OR b) did not notify BBB as to their satisfaction.

  Unanswered:

  The business failed to respond to the dispute.

  Unpursuable:

  BBB is unable to locate the business.

  On May 6, 2024, I contracted with LBR ****************** Services in ***** to fix a self-made residential lawn fountain built by the maintenance man at ********************************** in ****** during the summer of 2023. The fountain would always start, but not stay running. We tried all summer long to fix but gave up until this spring. I hired professionals (LBR) to figure out what the problem was. I paid a separate assessment visit fee (visit #1 @ $125.00). The first problem identified was that the pump was not working. Rather than continue to inspect the fountain and provide a full report of design or operational issues, the staff simply ordered a new pump.The staff installed the new pump, started the fountain and left (visit #2 @ $940.99.) The fountain stopped running within an hour. They were called back and identified that the tub basin was cracked (visit #3). They ordered a new tub basin. The staff installed the new tub, started the fountain and once again left (visit #4 @ $751.77). Within 24 hours, the fountain stopped running again.My only expectation was to have a fountain that would keep running. Throughout this process, both my husband and I commented multiple times that we thought both the original and the LBR pump were too big for this fountain. They new parts installed by LBR were identical to the broken ones being replaced which only replicated the original problem(s). By failing to properly diagnose the, fountain was not fixed. LBRs one and only solution came at additional expense and was not viable because it did not address the over-sized pump it would only perpetuate the problem. So we took it upon ourselves and exchanged the too-big pump for a smaller pump that was more appropriate for this fountain and the performance was greatly improved. LBR did not fulfill the contracted objective. They provided working components of a fountainnot components that contributed to make a working fountain.

  Business Response

  Date: 06/26/2024

  *************** called LBR regarding a water feature that was not working. She stated she needed to get it fixed before mothers day weekend and emphasized the importance of the water feature becoming operational again before that weekend. Upon initial inspection, we noticed the pump itself did not work. Asking the client how she wanted to proceed, an exact match of the existing pump was special ordered and overnighted. There were no specifics on the type of pump she was wanting, simply to replace the pump that was bad. It is protocol for our company to replace any parts with the original existing material if possible. After the new pump was installed, and water had filled the storage tote that was being used as a catch basin for the water feature, we then scrambled again to find the matching box, which we did. After the basin was replaced and filled again, the pump worked as it is designed. We were then later informed that the pump stopped working due to there not being enough water in the basin. It was explained that the design of the water feature was flawed in retaining water due to the water dropping from  a distance of 6-7 feet and splashing out onto the concrete and surrounding areas. We were then told that she wanted the entire water feature looked at and all of the issues fixed which was not our understanding. We replaced a non working pump, we replaced the exact tote used prior and before the weekend deadline. Communication from the client to LBR moving forward ceased. Instead, we received an email stating her and her husband worked on the pump and eventually replaced it with a "$50 pump from Lowes". If the client had reached out to express more concerns, LBR would have been more than happy to accommodate and help resolve any issues. Once the client removes products or alters products, any warranty is void at that point. LBR stands with the work that was requested was completed. If further work was needed, LBR would have quoted the work as with all the other work performed. Since all work was completed as originally requested by **************, LBR will not be issuing a refund for completed, agreed to work orders / estimates.  LBR considers this issue closed.

  Customer Answer

  Date: 07/08/2024

  As the person who contracted for this work and paid almost $2,000 with unacceptable results I am not satisfied with the response LBR *************************** LBR Landscaping & **** Services made to resolve this issue. If upon reading this complaint and knowing it will be accessible for three (3) years, it gives at least one person pause when they think about: How they either choose to operate a business; or What is important to them when they go about selecting a business to service their needs.

   

  Stop to consider that the intended individuals to benefit from this working fountain are residents in a ******************* If and when the opportunity again presents itself for LBR to be part of something bigger than themselves, I hope they dont squander it like they did this time.

   

  During my initial contact with LBR, I simply explained the problem of having a self-made fountain that we could not keep running and that my reason for calling was to have professionals figure out why it would not work and fix it. I learned about LBR as the result of a ****** search on residential fountain repair. Their website references irrigation. If my scope of work did not fall within their wheelhouse, they should have politely declined my request. As it was, I believed I had hired a professional service to meet my needs.

   

  True, when the existing pump was diagnosed as broken, I agreed to order a new pump. True, I had no conversation regarding specifics of what type of replacement pump was being ordered. My expectation was that paid professionals would ensure it would be appropriate for this feature. It was at this point in the process that I spoke with the office administrator who told me the pump was not available locallythat it would have to be ordered. To express my disappointment, I simply made an off-handed remark to the effect of, man, you have to order it? I was hoping we could have this done by Mothers Day. This was the one and only time I ever mentioned Mothers Dayand it certainly was not with the intent of demanding a completion date. The fact that LBR interpreted this simple comment as emphasis of importance is out of my control. I never asked, and was never told, any order was overnighted. The fact that LBR created a self-imposed timeline and rely on that as the premise of their defense is up to them.

   

  Note: The only reason this comment was made was because their quick response to schedule the first visit did set my expectations that this could be a quick turnaround. When I first contacted them, I expressed no completion date. Throughout the process, in written, phone or in-person conversations, I expressed no completion date. Even in my complaint to BBB, I never expressed a completion date.

   

  Protocol aside, if a client contracts with you to fix something and you charge $125 for an assessment, part of diagnosing the problem should be to perform and overall assessment. The solution at that point should not be to just stop at the first problem encountered (like replacing a B.O. pump in this instance) but to identify any/all possibilities for why things are not working. If you dont consider sound hydrologic principles, then let common sense prevail. If A+B=Current situation, why think replacing A+B with an exact match would offer a different conclusion? Not to mention, by this point in the process, I had verbally mentioned to the Office Administrator and one of the technicians onsite that we suspected the pump may be too big (1) (2) This was the beginning of our thoughts or concerns not being considered.

   

  When LBR described scrambling to fix the next problem encountered, they fail to mention that this next problem should have been identified in the initial assessment instead of two visits later. This foresight would have mitigated the rush. I do applaud their efforts to get this replaced; however, on its own, this repair did not fix the problem with the fountain not running. I also take exception to LBRs self-imposed Weekend Deadline. Once again implying that I had made demands of a completion date. I will remind LBR that on Mothers Day this fountain was dead in the water (pardon the pun) due to their ill-fated repairs.  When the fountain stopped working this second time, we spoke with the Manager of LBRs ********************* on the phone while we were onsite trying to figure out why it had stopped running again. During this conversation, we once again questioned the size of the pump (3) and the fact that using this large of a pump might, in turn, require a larger collection basin. This was the next time any concerns we expressed were not acknowledged. There was not even a counter conversation from anyone with LBR considering if this could or could not contribute to the situation.

   

  It was that evening, still on May 13^th that I wrote LBR an e-mail (original Attachment #8) reiterating the phone conversation earlier that day and formally questioned the size of the pump (4), the next time our concerns were not validated. In preparing this response, I re-read how I had explained our efforts earlier in the day to minimize the flow of the pump. I said we adjusted the pumps valve. WE NEVER TOUCHED THE PUMP. We adjusted the discharge valve built into the original fountain feature. I apologize for any confusion my wording caused the point being that there was NEVER A VOID OF WARRANTY at that point.

   

  LBR says we should have reached out and expressed more concerns so they could accommodate and resolve any issues. The contents of my May 13^th e-mail leave no question of our concerns. I have numbered four references of our concerns in this writing none of which were accommodated. Instead, they respond the next day May 14^th  (original Attachment #9) holding responsible the basic design of the rainfall feature for the fountain running out of waternever mentioning the excessive water loss due to the over sized pump installed. Again, no validation of our thoughts and concerns.  Instead, they offer their ONE AND ONLY solution of installing an auto fill.

   

  There was no way we could entertain their one and only solution:

  (1)   The irrigation system was not operable.

  (2)   Each time the basin emptied, it took a full 15 minutes with water hose at full capacity to refill the tank.

  (3)   With the size of the pump being used, the water level in the basin would empty every two hours.

  (4)   The suggested justification for paying LBR more money to install an auto fill is that, when emptied, the basin could be filled automatically by using a control timer to start the fill twice a day for 2-3 minutes or as needed. DO THE ***** As installed, the auto fill would be running continuously ALL day to feed this monster pump and still not keep the basin full.

   

  Needless to say, it was at this point on May 14^th, after the latest full disregard of anything we had to say, that we set our own plan in motion to confirm if the size of the pump was indeed the problem. At no point did we work on the equipment installed by LBR. Instead, we filled the tank, started the fountain running and adjusted the discharge valve ON THE FOUNTAIN. After seeing that the basin would have run out of water again within two hours, we started a set of controlled scenarios to see if we could confirm that the problem was the oversized pump. After visiting the site once or twice a day to run the fountain with the water basin cover both on and off and then running the fountain with the water basin cover decorative rock both on and off, this fact was confirmed on May 16^th a full two days after LBRs ill-advised resolution response and having NEVER touched LBR equipment. If only LBR had reached out and expressed more concerns and tried to accommodate and resolve any issues. (That comment works both ways!)

   

  True, it was at this point that we pulled the LBR pump and replaced it with a more appropriately sized $58 pump from Lowes. Our first day, this pump ran for 19 hours in windy conditions while using not even a half-basin of water. While this is still not the ideal situation, it is workable.

   

  The photo comparison originally included as Attachment #**, in conjunction with this table exemplifies the vast difference between the LBR pump and the Lowes pump and further justifies the basis of this complaint.

   

  In simplest terms, to describe just how MAMMOTH the pump provided by LBR is and how detrimental it was to the overall proficiency of this simple fountain, that comparison photo and technical information supports our solution. This photo depicts how LBR used four (4) reducers to accomplish plumbing their pump down from 1 inch to inch.  It doesnt take a hydrological engineer to understand this was not the correct and practical solution just common sense. For my simple 6 rainfall fountain, I have no need for a pump that propels ***** gallons of water per hour.

   

  Description	Discharge Size	Capacity GPH @ 6 Head	Total Head Capacity	Total GPH	Cost to Purchase and Install
  LBR Pump	1	3600 Gal	36	4500	$940.09
  Lowes Pump		175 Gal	7	500	$57.98

   

  On May 20, I sent a formal resolution offer to LBR asking for a partial refund directed at the invoices for an assessment that never happened and refund for the costs associated with installing an over-sized pump. I even deducted the cost of the Lowess pump and offered to return the LBR pump. I see this as a more than equitable resolution considering their work was not completed. Note: Even then, I expressed no completion date.

   

  My final point of contention would be LBRs comment that it wasnt until after the work had been performed, that I told them I wanted the entire feature looked at and all the issues fixed. When I made the first call to LBR, they asked me what I needed. I told them I had a fountain that would not stay running and that I wanted professionals to figure out why it would not work and fix it. LBR accepts that job (if you dont have a full understanding of the scope of work, ask for clarification) and pockets almost $2000 to replace exact parts and then calls the job complete leaving the fountain with the same problems they were hired to fix but only managed to replicate. My May 13^th letter of concerns expressed my frustrations that I still had a fountain that would not keep running. Several times during this process, I asked for assurance that what they were doing would leave me with a fountain that worked. You dont have to go any further than read LBRs May 14^th response (original Attachment #9) to see that they have a good understanding of the problems associated with the design of this type of water feature and that the main issue was non-recycling of water causing the basin to run dry. There is no need to look at the entire feature because when it runs, it runs. You just cannot keep it running due to lack of water, When the customer questions the size of the pump repeatedly, look at that as an opportunity to consider validate acknowledge accommodate all in an effort to resolve the continuing issue.